This is an edited transcript of an interview with Senate Majority Whip Dick Durbin by The Republican and MassLive.
The following is a transcript of an interview with Senate Majority Whip Dick Durbin, an Illinois Democrat, conducted by the Republican and MassLive.com on Friday, June 22, 2012. The transcript has been edited slightly for length and clarity.
Q: Since President Obama’s first full month in office, the economy has gained around 780,000 private sector jobs, and unemployment has remained above 8 percent. What is to stop voters from believing Romney when he claims he can do better?
Dick Durbin
Durbin: His record. As governor, for instance, the often-quoted Massachusetts ranking 47th out of 50 states in job creation. It’s an indication that he didn’t show any special talent or skill on job creation as governor, and he basically offers no new plan for this economy. What he offers is to return to George W. Bush’s economic policy which, sadly, brought us to this recession.
Q: What about Obama’s record?
Durbin: I remember the day that he put his hand on Abraham Lincoln’s bible to be sworn in. It was the month we lost 750,000 jobs. The economy was in freefall when he came in, and we’ve stabilized. We’re growing slowly. We’re all anxious for it to grow more quickly, but we’ve turned a corner. We’re moving in a positive way. And to return to Bush economic policies or Romney’s Massachusetts plan would not help.
Q: What will it take to spark the economy? Do you support more stimulus?
Durbin: If the president had his way and if I could have helped him, we would have put more into the stimulus to help in the early stages in this recession. But we ran into resistance. The only way we could win three Republican votes in the Senate was to cut the stimulus, which we ended up doing. I would say there are elements the president’s pointed to that are key. First, the right investments in our future, in education, innovation, and infrastructure….The other thing that clearly will be part of it as we come to the end of the year is an honest plan to deal with our debt and what we’re facing, and I believe the president is going do that….I’ve talked to him privately about this. He is anxious to tackle that. We face, as we say, the cliff at the end of the year that will force our hand.
Q: Will there have to be some raised revenues, raised taxes?
Durbin: Yes. I was on the Bowles-Simpson Commission, voted for it. The only way to honestly deal with the deficit is to put everything on the table. That’s revenues, spending, entitlements, put them all on the table and deal with them in a fair way. We’ve had no luck with Romney who took the Grover Norquist no tax pledge. You can’t get from here to fiscal sanity without some new revenues. Unfortunately, Romney has said he wouldn’t consider that.
Q: Do you see the European debt crisis as a significant threat to the U.S. economy, and should the U.S. get involved?
Durbin: We’ve left it to Europe to solve the problems, and Germany’s been the lead there. We have our own problems to deal with, creating jobs in America, but there’s no doubt a precipitous fall in the European community would hurt us, and I hope it doesn’t happen. We can’t control it. But it clearly is an important factor. They’re major trading partners and major allies.
Q: You wrote the DREAM act. President Obama essentially went around Congress to implement the policy that Congress couldn’t. Was this the right thing to do, and doesn’t this set a dangerous precedent?
Durbin: It was absolutely the right thing to do. Two years ago, I sent the president a letter, it was April of 2010. It was cosigned by me and (Indiana Republican) Sen. (Dick) Lugar asking for the executive order that was issued last Friday. A year ago with 21 senators joining us we renewed the request. So we have felt for the longest time that since this House and this Congress will not take up any immigration issues, and the DREAM Act faces a filibuster in the Senate from the Republicans, that this was literally the only way to protect these young people. I think it was one of President Obama’s best decisions. It was a historic humanitarian moment. These young people now will have the peace of mind that they can stay here legally to pursue their education and their lives. So I totally support it. Did he go around Congress? He used authority which every president has well recognized when he said we will not prosecute this group of individuals. Every executive has that power to pick and choose the power of prosecution. In this case, he said as long as they came as children, complete at least high school, have no serious criminal record they can have renewed protection every two years. I think that’s sensible.
Q: What about Mitt Romney’s claim that it’s better to have a long-term fix implemented by Congress than a short term fix?
Durbin: What is Mitt Romney’s long-term fix on immigration? During the campaign for president, he said he would veto the DREAM Act. He never said one thing that you could point to aside from stricter efforts at the border. He never said one thing relative to immigration. So this notion that he even has a long-term plan, I’m still waiting to see it. I don’t think he does.
Q: One of Obama’s signature accomplishments, the Affordable Care Act, is before the Supreme Court. What happens in Congress if the Supreme Court overturns it?
Durbin: We’re holding our breath….And I just don’t know. I don’t know if they’ll uphold it, strike it or strike parts….The direction of the Affordable Care Act is inevitable. We have to move to the day where we are reducing the rate of growth in medical cost and still rewarding quality care. Your state’s living proof of it. The cost of medical insurance has been going down in Massachusetts under your plan, Romneycare. So if it continues, it’s an indication that personal responsibly or an individual mandate is a key element in putting together an integrated medical system that can save money.
Q: If the Affordable Care Act is overturned, how will Congress pursue it?
Durbin: It will be interesting. There’s clear division between the Republican House and the Democratic Senate about whatever might happen. I don’t look for many changes, if any, for the rest of the year. I ‘m going to keep my reservation on that, because I don’t know what the court is going to do.
Q: How important was Scott Brown’s role in both weakening the Dodd-Frank financial reform bill and in getting it passed?
Durbin: His vote was important in passing it, but he apparently has some serious misgivings. …Since the bill passed, it’s been pretty clear that Sen. Brown wants to weaken parts of it, the Volcker rule and other elements. I think that this financial reform bill was a necessary response to the recession. We made it clear that there will be no more too big to fail moments in Washington, and we need to make sure that we have the right oversight and regulations when it comes to our financial institutions. What (J.P. Morgan) Chase went through just recently, losing $2 billion, was an indication of what could happen to any bank, if the bank didn’t have the resources of Chase, they could find themselves in trouble again.
Q: Scott Brown has crossed party lines on some major votes, Dodd-Frank, the Violence Against Women Act. Do you consider Brown a bipartisan senator, and conversely, how can Warren convince voters she would be bipartisan?
Durbin: I feel better speaking about Elizabeth Warren because I’ve known her longer and encouraged her to run. She has been a friend and we’ve worked together on some important issues. She was the one who came to our Senate Democratic retreat and suggested the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. That was her idea. I want up to her afterwards and said I want to introduce the bill, and I did. I worked with her putting the bill together. She is the clearest voice for middle income families and the economic problems they face. I just think she would be a powerful force in the Senate to give working families in this country a fighting chance. They’re falling further and further behind. They need a strong champion like her.
Q: You sponsored the Democratic bill freezing student loan rates. Is Congress going to be able to compromise?
Durbin: I think we’re going to get that done. I think we’re going to get it done this coming week, we’re very close to an agreement.
Q: Any sense what that’s going to look like?
Durbin: It has to be paid for. There’s no question about the impact on the students, a good one, on keeping the interest rates low. But the pay-fors, I think we’ve come up with a reasonable list. Republicans are looking at it. I’m hopeful.
Q: Under President Obama, Congress hasn’t been able to pass a budget bill for the past three years. Does that say anything about Obama’s leadership?
Durbin: In fairness, the Budget Enforcement Act, a law passed by Congress on a bipartisan basis, signed by the president, currently governs our budget process. I’m an appropriations chairman, I know under the appropriations act how much I can spend. It’s the same as a budget resolution, except it’s stronger and it is the law instead of a resolution. It was signed the president so I have no choice but to follow the law and we do. For two years now, we’ve had this law governing our budgets. As far as the president’s role in this, this is really Congress’s responsibility. The president submits a budget. Congress has to decide what they’re going to spend by budget resolution. We’ve done it by statute because of the confrontations we ran into last year between the House and Senate.
Q: What’s going to happen with the with the transportation reauthorization act?
Durbin: We passed a bipartisan Senate bill 74-22 and the House has failed to pass any new transportation bill. They’ve extended the current law which will cost us a lot of jobs. We’re hoping this coming week there will be a breakthrough. We’ve been negotiating for the last week….If we don’t, I’ve called on the speaker to call the Senate bill for a vote in the House. He’s refused to do that. I think he owes it to the people in this country to at least vote on Senate bill.
Q: Is it legitimate for the Obama campaign to be going after Mitt Romney’s record on Bain Capital, on outsourcing, or isn’t that just free enterprise?
Durbin: Here’s why it’s important. Mitt Romney made a lot of money and was successful as a businessman. The practices he followed such as outsourcing jobs are not good for this country. As he talks with some pride about his background in business, I think we need to make it clear some of the very practices that make you successful in business do not serve our country well. Creating jobs right here in America has to be a president’s highest priority. At Bain Capital, creating jobs in America clearly wasn’t their highest priority. Returning profits for investors was their highest priority.
Q: Isn’t that as it should be?
Durbin: No question about it. Clearly, they’re two different worlds, and when you point to one world saying I was successful in business, therefore I’d be a great president, I think it’s appropriate to say, the things that made you successful and profitable may not be good things for this country, such as outsourcing jobs. Most Americans would agree the president’s first priority should be creating jobs in this country, trying to discourage them from being sent overseas.